Time To Shut Down The BBC

[perrykneeham]

Who's having a hissy fit? Just pointing out how silly it is to have a discussion programme where people just say incorrect things and aren't corrected.

[moggyonspeed]

May 6, 2024 16:00:05 GMT mids said:

The British army in 1939 were one of the most mechanised in the world. Compare the kreuts who were mostly horse drawn by a long way.

So what you’re saying is that a whole bunch of Nazi horses handed the mechanised BEF its arse on a plate at Dunkerque?

I didn’t realise that the British army was that sh*t. Thanks for clarifying.

[mids]

Like I said, the French and Belgian command were utterly convinced that the Kreuts wouldn't be able to get through the Ardennes, although they did. Don't forget, it was a French and Belgian show with us in support. It was, after all, their countries we were helping defend. It's odd that you don't recognise the Franco-Belgian lead in this part of the war.

[perrykneeham]

It is fun to watch the LibLabs frantically trying to work a new historical narrative: one where the German and Italian conquest of Europe was our fault and, in many ways, unprogressive and reactionary.

[mids]

Hahaha, nailed it.

[moggyonspeed]

May 7, 2024 7:55:19 GMT mids said:

Like I said, the French and Belgian command were utterly convinced that the Kreuts wouldn't be able to get through the Ardennes, although they did. Don't forget, it was a French and Belgian show with us in support. It was, after all, their countries we were helping defend. It's odd that you don't recognise the Franco-Belgian lead in this part of the war.

So what you’re saying is that the highly mechanised BEF didn’t support the Belgians and French nearly enough. Some support!

Yes, the Wehrmacht relied on horses, but this was largely to move its artillery and some supplies, as the whole notion of Blitzkrieg relied on rapid advance; horses in no way can move assault troops quickly enough and therefore in the numbers to make a Blitzkrieg assault viable, so the notion of a horse and cart being useable in a lightning war is demonstrably laughable.

Blitzkrieg was quite simple, and in that simplicity lay its power in attack ...

- Soften up the enemy’s front line with a massive artillery barrage, with its main focus being on an intelligence-based weak spot;
- When that weak spot gives way, mount a heavy tank/mechanised-infantry assault at that point, sufficiently reinforced to weigh the odds in the attackers’ favour;
- Concurrently, switch the artillery’s focus from the front line to the enemy rear, with Ju87s acting in close support, focussed on enemy supply lines, reinforcements and escape routes

In the Blitzkrieg role the Ju87 was a good aircraft, but (baloo is right) for the BoB it was next to useless.

[perrykneeham]

So the Leuftwaffe was ill-equiped for its own tactical doctrine? And the RAF met the technical and material challenge by maintaining air superiority. Conditions under which the Steukas were like uncovered meat.

[perrykneeham]

Worth remembering ....

"In October 1936, King Leopold III announced that Belgium would remain neutral in the event of another war in Europe as part of what he termed an Independent Policy (Politique d'Indépendance).[7] To this end, the Belgian government tried to steer a path away from alliances: leaving the Locarno Treaty, repudiating a defence pact with France signed in 1920[8] and receiving a guarantee of neutrality from Nazi Germany in 1937.[8]

The German Government considers that the inviolability and integrity of Belgium are common interests of the Western Powers. It confirms its determination that in no circumstances will it impair this inviolability and integrity and that it will at all times respect Belgian territory ...

— German guarantee of neutrality, 13 October 1937"

[mids]

Typical. Teupical.

[voice]

The RAF lost close to a 1000 planes during the battle of France, though much were older less modern kit, good job Downing kept the bulk of fighters in the UK and withdrew the modern fighters as soon as he could. Though the RAFs deployment in France had little real impact on the outcome.

[perrykneeham]

Strategically sound and doctrinal correct, then?

[voice]

Oh yes, no argument about that.

[flatandy]

Yes. Thanks to Chamberlain the RAF was capable of that and had developed sounds strategy and doctrine, and didn't have to fight with Hawker Harts and Gloster Gauntlets.

[perrykneeham]

The modernisation programme pre-dated Nev. That being said, I have no problem with his reputation being reviewed more fairly.

[voice]

I've always thought Nevil was decent sort really, he was haunted by his experiences in the First War, but reluctantly saw he must delay what was coming to help GB make up for lost time and while he was part of apeacment he wasn't quite as craven or blind to the rise of Nazism and fascism as many of his Tory colleagues. So throwing the Sudatens under the bus to buy 18 months wasn't quite the betrayal it's often portrayed. And he did draw a line at Poland and said no more.

[mids]

Winnie> Nev.

[flatandy]

Yeah, Voice's position is similar to mine. I'm sure Chamberlain was a useless feckless shitbag, what with him being a Tory. But his reputation as the Appeaser In Chief because of Munich has always felt a bit unfair when he was actually buying time that needed to be bought.

[perrykneeham]

"As a controlled explosion rocked the Dali on Monday, nearly two dozen sailors remained on board, below deck in the massive ship's hull.

The simultaneous blasts sent pieces of Baltimore's once iconic Francis Scott Key Bridge into the dark waters of Maryland's Patapsco River, seven weeks after its collapse left six people on the bridge dead and the Dali marooned.

Authorities - and the crew - hope that the demolition will mark the beginning of the end of a long process that has left the 21 men on board trapped and cut off from the world, thousands of miles from their homes."

www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-69011124

"Trapped"? "Cut off from the World"?

[mids]

Not wanting to go home?

[flatandy]

Not permitted to leave by US authorities. Quite common, but crappy for the crew. It’s actually fair, though. A boat left unattended basically rots and decays so leaving it alone is a bad choice. They’ve done the same with a Russian Oligarch’s yacht in San Diego. It’s costing the country a fortune but it’s better than the alternative. The crew are genuinely trapped.