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Post by perrykneeham on Mar 31, 2019 13:35:24 GMT
Avi,
Have you watched Shtisel? It really is very good.
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avieder
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Post by avieder on Mar 31, 2019 16:35:24 GMT
No. They are one and the same. Biblical scholars have shown that the Torah contains too many contradictions and infelicities to be devine, and it instead come into being over a very long period of time. There is no evidence that the Torah was written by God. Studying the Torah, even the tiniest portion thereof, and the Oral Law which is an integral of it is a matter of life. Whole bookcases of analysis of every passage, sentence, word, letter and even tone marks.... Its not something academic. I am but a small ignorant fool... The Torah is an entity by its own it exists everywhere at all time. It is the word of G-d at all time. Something I once compared to Gravity. It is there, you feel it, you must abide by its force yet it cannot be seen.... |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2019 17:22:24 GMT
DAMASCUS, SYRIA (11:20 P.M)- Israeli snipers shot dead four in the Gaza Strip and injured over 200 this Saturday. According to the Gaza Health Ministry, four Palestinians have been confirmed dead and 244 injured. Those killed were identified as Mohammed Jehad sa’ad (20 years old), Adham Nedal Amara (17 years old), Hashem Abu Alkhair (17 years old) and Bilal Al-Najjar (17 years old). Ah, well known writer for Breitbart: Breitbart News is headquartered in Los Angeles, with bureaus in Texas, London, and Jerusalem. ...Its journalists are widely considered to be ideologically driven, and some of its content has been called misogynistic, xenophobic, and racist by liberals and many traditional conservatives alike. ..the site has published a number of lies, conspiracy theories, and intentionally misleading stories. ... |
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avieder
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Post by avieder on Mar 31, 2019 19:52:50 GMT
The Ten Commandments were a point to show that at no time in human history they could be "invented" because they contradict basic instincts of survival of say apes.
I am not here to persuade you to believe.
Just trying to show you that faith is not bassless. It is what differentiates us from the animal world.
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bertruss2
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Post by bertruss2 on Mar 31, 2019 23:51:10 GMT
You are an animal. Humans are of the family of Great Apes which include Chimpanzees, Gorillas and Orangutans.
What makes us different is our language ability. This can be used to talk sense or nonsense. Religion is an early development in modern humans and is in the nonsense category. That's not to say it isn't useful. It is a unifying factor, enabling tribes to work together to defeat their enemies.
But it's outdated and dangerous. We want to use science and technology to live better lives. The role that religion plays in dividing the human race is likely to have fatal consequences in the nuclear age. In the Middle East, Israel's monopoly of nuclear weapons enables it to survive. When this monopoly is broken, the prospects for Armageddon will be high.
That's why Christian evangelical Zionists take such an interest in Israel. They are expecting a war to destroy Israel and lead to the end of the world. Their religion makes them believe that Christians of their sect will be taken up into Heaven and live a supernatural life forever.
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moggyonspeed
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Post by moggyonspeed on Apr 1, 2019 9:39:37 GMT
Of course, you could both be wrong ...
- How do you know that other animals don't have language?
- ... or faith?
How presumptive of you to imply, for example, that because animals don't have a language either in the oral tradition of or written down in a way understandable by humans, that such language doesn't exist.
I guess this belief may be because these collected stories from round the campfire cite this God person as saying that we have dominion over the animals merely because we have dominion over the animals - a "might makes right" argument which we somehow think is wrong when one set of humans applies it to another set of humans.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 1, 2019 11:15:02 GMT
Strictly speaking, language is oral.
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moggyonspeed
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Post by moggyonspeed on Apr 1, 2019 11:48:59 GMT
And there you have it - "strictly speaking" in OUR language. Strictly speaking in scientific terms, any sound that can be modulated can be used to signal with which, from bees, to birds, to fish, and mammals on many levels of the tree of evolution, we know they do. The mere fact that we, in our wisdom, haven't yet worked out what their language means doesn't render it less valid.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 1, 2019 11:53:19 GMT
The word 'language' is derived from the Latin 'lingua' - tongue.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 1, 2019 11:54:49 GMT
I don't disagree with your basic assumption by the way. I'm simply being pedantic.
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bertruss2
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Post by bertruss2 on Apr 1, 2019 12:56:43 GMT
Animals communicate with sounds and gestures. It's a simple language' that helps them find food, mate, rear offspring, avoid predators and live their lives. Your life and language are very different from that of chimpanzees, although there are basic similarities. It's the complexity of human language that makes the difference. It's the difference between living naked up a tree and being in an environment created by science and technology.
When you locate a chimpanzee church or a chimpanzee priest, let us know. Or perhaps you think they are 'spiritual but not religious'. So, maybe you claim to have met a chimpanzee guru with his followers who bring him bananas to pay him for for wisdom and magic powers.
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avieder
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Post by avieder on Apr 1, 2019 12:59:30 GMT
Ah, well known writer for Breitbart: Breitbart News is headquartered in Los Angeles, with bureaus in Texas, London, and Jerusalem. ...Its journalists are widely considered to be ideologically driven, and some of its content has been called misogynistic, xenophobic, and racist by liberals and many traditional conservatives alike. ..the site has published a number of lies, conspiracy theories, and intentionally misleading stories. ... Can you please relate to the contents of my posts rather than to the person? (If you understand the difference that is) |
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avieder
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Post by avieder on Apr 1, 2019 13:16:55 GMT
Studying the Torah, even the tiniest portion thereof, and the Oral Law which is an integral of it is a matter of life. Whole bookcases of analysis of every passage, sentence, word, letter and even tone marks.... Its not something academic. I am but a small ignorant fool... The Torah is an entity by its own it exists everywhere at all time. It is the word of G-d at all time. Something I once compared to Gravity. It is there, you feel it, you must abide by its force yet it cannot be seen.... That was my whole point, the Torah is based on oral and not written in stone, Hence the reason you keep banging on the ten commandments. Which is according to every religion is the "norm" sigh. You are quite right. The Jewish faith is based on the Oral law. The Torah is the foundation and the Oral Law stems from it. There were sections of Jews who did not accept that Oral Law (Tzadokites). Their way of understanding is documented in our books like the Mishnah and Gemarah but only for study's sake. The words of the Torah that were engraved on stone are now written on leather scrolls. |
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moggyonspeed
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Post by moggyonspeed on Apr 1, 2019 13:21:48 GMT
"When you locate a chimpanzee church or a chimpanzee priest, let us know. Or perhaps you think they are 'spiritual but not religious'. So, maybe you claim to have met a chimpanzee guru with his followers who bring him bananas to pay him for for wisdom and magic powers."
... and therein lies part of the problem. Churches, priests, gurus and other organisational constructs render many religions powerful, that power being itself one of the main elements that those religions guard most jealously - the power to control - and in that sense they become pseudo-states in their own right.
For all their lack of complex languages like humans', I can't think of many non-human animals that go out of their way to kill en-masse, subdue and steal from fellow animals - and yet the Pope to this day eats off gold plate stolen from the Americas, a part of the world that had language pre-Cortés, btw.
Then of course, our complex language and superb reasoning skills render us SO clever, don't they? At the risk of cross-posting, the UK's politicians, with all their education, have not achieved that much in nearly three years of arguing the toss about Brexit, have they?
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avieder
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Post by avieder on Apr 1, 2019 13:22:47 GMT
Can you please drink this poisonous sh*t and ignore the label saying POISON. Right. Exactly the same! Every opinion that differs from yours is necessarily poison. A place that only your own opinion can exist must be a very lonely place. |
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avieder
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Post by avieder on Apr 1, 2019 13:35:11 GMT
You are an animal. Humans are of the family of Great Apes which include Chimpanzees, Gorillas and Orangutans. What makes us different is our language ability. This can be used to talk sense or nonsense. Religion is an early development in modern humans and is in the nonsense category. That's not to say it isn't useful. It is a unifying factor, enabling tribes to work together to defeat their enemies. But it's outdated and dangerous. We want to use science and technology to live better lives. The role that religion plays in dividing the human race is likely to have fatal consequences in the nuclear age. In the Middle East, Israel's monopoly of nuclear weapons enables it to survive. When this monopoly is broken, the prospects for Armageddon will be high. That's why Christian evangelical Zionists take such an interest in Israel. They are expecting a war to destroy Israel and lead to the end of the world. Their religion makes them believe that Christians of their sect will be taken up into Heaven and live a supernatural life forever. You are free to relate yourself to the family of apes. I relate myself to Adam & Eve who were created in the image of G-d and to Avraham my forefather. In your geneology tree you are the most developed and your offsprings are more and better than you. In my geneology my forefathers were the nearest to G-d and I am but a dwarf sitting on the shoulder of giants. |
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Post by bertruss2 on Apr 1, 2019 13:45:13 GMT
I'm not saying that humans are morally superior to orangutans or other great apes. I don't think it would even be a sensible argument to have.
Intelligence, obviously, can be used for good or evil. It can be used to organize the imprisonment of millions of Palestinians, in high-tech methods to control the airspace, coastal waters and land around them and to commit atrocities against them with the latest weapons. It can be used to churn out endless propaganda to promote these evils.
It can be used in pointless discussions of theological nonsense.
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bertruss2
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Post by bertruss2 on Apr 1, 2019 13:50:42 GMT
You are in the animal kingdom as a matter of scientific classification, not personal choice. Avraham, if he ever existed, was as much a member of the great ape family as you. Adam and Eve and G-d are fictional characters, created by the human imagination.
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Gort
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Post by Gort on Apr 1, 2019 15:18:17 GMT
And the insane excuses of brain washing keeps on coming. You have such an inferiority complex that you lack the insight that human beings could come up with theses things by their own merrit and enginuity rather than the involvement of some invisible sky god. Who gave the Egyiptians the technology to build the pyramids? People aquire techical knowlege as time goes on. Ha ha! And you think yourself intelligent. You are the fool because you have been fooled.. Just as I was told, here you are trying to bring me down to your level ... Sure the Egyptians built pyramids. There are Greek and Roman phylosophies. In Stonehenge and Easter Island they errected fantastic structure. But no other culture created values that are encapsuled in The Ten commandments. That is said only to denounce atheists. You seem to have a high opinion of yourself, a bit like those Natsiz had of their self always thought they were above every one else. Well I got news for you Afukingmigo, no one who believes in fuking faries is above me. And (Just as you were told) so you were even advised,, and that advice did'nt happen to come from high above did it. Lol. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 1, 2019 16:29:43 GMT
Ah, well known writer for Breitbart: Breitbart News is headquartered in Los Angeles, with bureaus in Texas, London, and Jerusalem. ...Its journalists are widely considered to be ideologically driven, and some of its content has been called misogynistic, xenophobic, and racist by liberals and many traditional conservatives alike. ..the site has published a number of lies, conspiracy theories, and intentionally misleading stories. ... Can you please relate to the contents of my posts rather than to the person? (If you understand the difference that is) I assumed you were referring to the pro-Israel hard-line anti-Islamist warmonger, Kemp, and not the others accusing Israel of murder. (It's called bias - but I don't know if you understand the word) |
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