Scooby Do
New Member
Where's my pic?
Posts: 21,324
|
Post by Scooby Do on Feb 5, 2009 6:36:50 GMT
|
|
avieder
New Member
never lie
Posts: 8,871
|
Post by avieder on Feb 5, 2009 6:52:58 GMT
That is the direct result of the fact that all the blond women in the world never protested against Barbi Dolls......  |
|
ricklinc
New Member
Nostalgia
Posts: 2,597
|
Post by ricklinc on Feb 5, 2009 8:19:53 GMT
No, it's the result of lefty lib damp patches demanding that everyone be tolerant and understanding and respect the freedom of minorities and do as they are fcuking told by the most insipid bunch of oppressors in history.
|
|
|
|
Post by flatandy on Feb 5, 2009 8:49:09 GMT
Oh, good grief. Do you not understand that gollywogs became racially tinged because when the Windrush generation arrived they were called gollywogs by kids as that was the only black reference point.
So it became a term of abuse, even if it started as just a doll.
The fact that the dolls were then made to look more and more like comedy "black and white minstrels" clearly didn't help, but it doesn't really matter. Their existence became offensive. Things can change their meaning.
As, clearly, nobody is harmed by not talking about gollywogs, and by not having gollywogs, and they are known now to be racially tinged and, frankly, everyone knows it (orif they don't they are so igonorant or stupid they shouldn't be allowed out of their padded rooms), I really don't see why people should want to own or talk about them.
I admit, I think it's clearly a bit silly and over-the-top as a proscription. But it's exists, and everyone knows the terminlogy is racially loaded. So just deal with it.
|
|
sushimo
New Member
One tequilla, Two Tequilla, Three Tequilla - Floor.
Posts: 243
|
Post by sushimo on Feb 5, 2009 9:02:47 GMT
Just wait till the Brown bear and the Polar bear teddies start having a go. It's a flaming toy for pities sake!!
|
|
|
|
Post by flatandy on Feb 5, 2009 9:14:19 GMT
It's a toy that deliberately became a term of racial abuse and, consequently, got turned into a parody-black-person, Sushi.
Polar Bear and Brown Bear have never been terms of racial abuse, so your comparison is stupid.
And, as you say, it's a toy. So no harm comes from omitting it from your language and from kids not having one. Easily done. Completely harmless. And racial term gets removed from language.
|
|
mids
New Member
Posts: 61,078
Member is Online
|
Post by mids on Feb 5, 2009 9:16:18 GMT
Oh, I feel so offended on behalf of people i've never met. I think I might faint.
|
|
|
|
Post by Victor Meldrew on Feb 5, 2009 9:37:31 GMT
Andy, another way of looking at this is that these dolls were a favourite for young children in this Country over many decades. None of them, mostly white kids, ever felt any racial connotations when they owned them, and indeed, many would take their golloywog to bed and feel safe by cuddling up to the black doll. Now, kids aren't able to show such affection because they're no longer allowed to buy the things.
As I say, you may feel that the doll giving white UK children an upbringing of feeling close to a black doll is irrelevant in the way they develop as teenagers and adults, but it's just an alternative view.
As for the Black & White Minstrel Show, that was probably the most popular Saturday night entertainment show on TV in the sixties and seventies, drawing in millions of viewers. Does anyone really believe that half of the Country tuned in to make fun of black people? I'm old enough to remember the show, and my (all white) family used to love it for what it was, decent family TV entertainment. It also helped to create many household names in television, and one person who has stated that the Black & White Minstrel Show was mostly responsible for his TV success was Lenny Henry.
|
|
|
|
Post by flatandy on Feb 5, 2009 9:45:07 GMT
I'm sure they didn't feel racial connotations, Victor.
But that's not really the point. When they saw black people for the first time, their only reference point was the gollywog they had, so you got the "Look mum! It's a gollywog!" stuff. Which meant that it then became used as a racial term. The original motivation doesn't matter.
And, again, no harm comes to anyone from not using the term (or having the toy). People are offended when it is used. So why the hell use it?
You only use it if
(a) you're a racist
(b) you're trying to shock in a very juvenile manner
(c) you're spectacularly thick and haven't realised people are offended by it
|
|
sweet soul
New Member
Keep The Faith !
Posts: 5,106 
|
Post by sweet soul on Feb 5, 2009 9:57:15 GMT
i bought my baby relation of mine a gollywog about 35 years ago, they was just toys, a bit like a gonk in status, never thought of anything racist about it.
|
|
sweet soul
New Member
Keep The Faith !
Posts: 5,106
|
Post by sweet soul on Feb 5, 2009 9:58:20 GMT
also i had a black doll bought for me when i was little, loved it, took it out in my pram : )
|
|
sweet soul
New Member
Keep The Faith !
Posts: 5,106
|
Post by sweet soul on Feb 5, 2009 10:00:11 GMT
if the queen likes them then are pretty special toys? cute and cool !!!
|
|
sushimo
New Member
One tequilla, Two Tequilla, Three Tequilla - Floor.
Posts: 243
|
Post by sushimo on Feb 5, 2009 10:05:14 GMT
If you think they are racist, then it's a mind thing, as far as I, and my family are concerned, they are gollies, a toy that happens to be black..........make white ones then!!  |
|
limeylily
New Member
I can be as daft as anyone ... I just have to try harder.
Posts: 308
|
Post by limeylily on Feb 5, 2009 10:06:53 GMT
It's a toy that deliberately became a term of racial abuse and, consequently, got turned into a parody-black-person, Sushi. Polar Bear and Brown Bear have never been terms of racial abuse, so your comparison is stupid. And, as you say, it's a toy. So no harm comes from omitting it from your language and from kids not having one. Easily done. Completely harmless. And racial term gets removed from language. Nope - As I said previously, I saw hundreds on sale in Yorkshire last year as keyrings, stuffed toys, etc. They're described as "gollies" to satisfy the PC brigade who tried unsuccessfully to have them banned. And they're even available to buy on lilne so no kids have to be deprived of owning one. ;D www.temptationgifts.com/acatalog/Collectable_Bears_and_Gollies.htmlwww.beargarden.co.uk/select.php?cat=4www.merrythought.co.uk/Gollies/c-1-78/ |
|
|
|
Post by justmyopinion on Feb 5, 2009 10:15:39 GMT
I've seen them on sale in a local garden centre - remember being very surprised as I thought that it wasn't acceptable now.
The doll itself isn't necessarily a problem as there are similar white rag doll representations around - it's the word and particularly the final three letters, that are the issue
|
|
mids
New Member
Posts: 61,078
Member is Online
|
Post by mids on Feb 5, 2009 10:20:10 GMT
I've seen them on sale in a local garden centre - remember being very surprised as I thought that it wasn't acceptable now. The doll itself isn't necessarily a problem as there are similar white rag doll representations around - it's the word and particularly the final three letters, that are the issue Yes, they should be called gollyafrocarribeans. |
|
|
|
Post by Victor Meldrew on Feb 5, 2009 10:23:35 GMT
Indeed just, which is why most people refer to them as gollies these days.
I grew up in the heart of the east end of London in the sixties and seventies. Although predominantly a Labour (old style socialist) heartland, it was also a hotbed for National Front types, and racial violence was a constant occurence. Of course, the term 'wog' was heard constantly, especially at places like Club Row Sunday market where they peddled their Bulldog magazines, and set out recruitment campaigns.
I can't stand that expression because of what it meant to me when I was growing up. I still love the gollies we have in our house though. They belong to my wife as a reminder of her childhood. They're cute, loved by the younger members of our family today, and we'd never part with them.
|
|
sweet soul
New Member
Keep The Faith !
Posts: 5,106
|
Post by sweet soul on Feb 5, 2009 10:25:43 GMT
i would never dream of calling anyone a wog, or a nigger, i hate that too.
|
|
|
|
Post by flatandy on Feb 5, 2009 10:41:45 GMT
If you think they are racist, then it's a mind thing, as far as I, and my family are concerned, they are gollies, a toy that happens to be black..........make white ones then!! It's not me that makes them racist. It's the fact that gollywog has been a term of racial abuse. |
|
|
|
Post by tarrant on Feb 5, 2009 10:43:32 GMT
Using language intended to be offensive is socially wrong. Whatever the term whoever the individual, black, disabled, woman, man, Old, or anything else.
But too many people are becoming too precious.
Gollywogs dols were never intended to be offensive. Children who owned them never saw them as anything other than cuddly toys.
But Thatcher was originally accused of comparing some tennis layer's hair to a gollywog, in private.
Today, on the news it is claimed she called someone a gollywog.
I suppose, by next week we can expect her to be accused of denying the holocaust!
Get real. I'm white, Male, not poor. I'm healthy, and live in the UK.
If anyone doesn't like it go wallow in your self pity somewhere else.
I've never enslaved anyone. I didn't colonialise anyone or persecute anyone.
I won't accept any responsibility because someone else apparently did.
|
|
