Golliwogs, By Appointment to HM the Queen

[omnipleasant]

That's pretty much what I think Vania. I'm not sure racist caricatures like golliwogs or cuddly, cute hook nosed yiddodolls should be banned as such. I just think we should point at anyone who desperately wants to buy them and say "cnut".

[flatandy]

Yeah, I'm with Vania on this, too.

These things shouldn't be banned. But it should be pointed out to anyone buying them that they have spectacularly strong racist associations and by buying the, they're probably reinforcing the stereotypes and charicatures, and allowing the racist language to stay in tthe vocabulary, and are probably doing in either in ignorance or as juvenile shock-merchants.

As for what the BBC should do - it's up to the BBC. I'd rather they didn't make lots of noise about it. But I can see why they think someone using Carol Thatcher's language might not be appropriate for mainstream live television. Particularly if she doesn't apologise, so she might think she's done nothing wrong. Which means there's a chance of it getting on air.

[Ian]

Does it somehow re-affirm your 'non-racist' credentials if you continually accuse everybody else of being racist?

[omnipleasant]

Absolutely Ian. I'm only arguing that calling a black person a golliwog might be, you know, a bit racist, to establish my Politically Correct Gone Too Far credentials.

It's not just common bloody decency or anything.

[mids]

Feb 6, 2009 17:35:36 GMT Ian said:

Does it somehow re-affirm your 'non-racist' credentials if you continually accuse everybody else of being racist?

I think it must. It's a sort of holier-than-thou McCarthyism where some people feel they have to loudly declare their anti-racism at every opportunity by calling as many people racist as they can.

[omnipleasant]

Does it somehow establish your heroic anti-PC credentials to argue in favour of racist abuse?

[Ian]

No, just to argue that not everyone who fails to soil their nappy in such spectacular fashion at the slightest hint of racism, necessarily must be racist themselves.

[omnipleasant]

Straw man.

[vania]

No Mids he's French so actually it's 'metis'.

Or 'of' dual heritage. Which is actually really irksome. Not because it's outrageously PC but because if you are mixed-race it does not necessarily follow that you will be of dual heritage. Plus it is perfectly possible to be of dual heritage yet not be mixed race.

[omnipleasant]

Isn't everyone "of dual heritage"?

[feral]

The big question is - why on earth are people defending this sh!t? Why is it so important to be able to use racist terms like this?

Whyelse would someone deliberately use racist language, Rick? Unless they were either racist, ignorant, or juvenile controversialists?

Urrrrrrm ..cos in their opinion it aint racist ???Just cos you and your mates say it is cos someone told you that's how you should think doesnt make it so

[omnipleasant]

"in their opinion it aint racist"

Oh well that's OK then. If the BNP insist it isn't racist, then it mustn't be.

[mids]

Feb 6, 2009 17:51:36 GMT @vania said:

No Mids he's French so actually it's 'metis'.

Or 'of' dual heritage. Which is actually really irksome. Not because it's outrageously PC but because if you are mixed-race it does not necessarily follow that you will be of dual heritage. Plus it is perfectly possible to be of dual heritage yet not be mixed race.

It's all so confusing. Can't we just say golliwog and leave it at that...?

[feral]

Oh well that's OK then. If the BNP insist it isn't racist, then it mustn't be.

LMAO .Are you not tired of repeating that claptrap yet?
I wonder what car models BNP members drive ...youd better find out and change your own model if it any way resembles one of theirs.

[flatandy]

Feb 6, 2009 17:47:32 GMT Ian said:

No, just to argue that not everyone who fails to soil their nappy in such spectacular fashion at the slightest hint of racism, necessarily must be racist themselves.

Why do you think I want to have a go at all racists? I don't dislike all racists. Some of my best friends are racist. I'm perfectly happy to be on a bus with racists. I've done it before, and although it made me quite nervous I didn't complain.

[feral]

It's all so confusing. Can't we just say golliwog and leave it at that...?

;D You've just made me really laugh out loud, mids

[sushimo]

I've heard that a lot of the BNP support Everton!

[vania]

Feb 6, 2009 17:47:32 GMT Ian said:

No, just to argue that not everyone who fails to soil their nappy in such spectacular fashion at the slightest hint of racism, necessarily must be racist themselves.

Strawman? More like big, massive, fcuking straw monster.

Who on earth has argued/is arguing this.

I just don't get people moaning and bleating that others may think they're racist if they use racist language in reference to somebody or like to buy racially caricatured dolls.

If I had a 'yidboy' doll and referred to each and every Jewish person I knew as 'the kike' I would expect people to probably think I was a bit anti-semetic. As well as rude.

[omnipleasant]

It might be claptrap Sushi, but it's your own argument.

Personally, I think certain things have racist connotations in society, and just because someone claims "I don't mean to be racist", like the BNP do, doesn't stop it being so.

And I think the more anti-PC heroes mirror their arguments, the more credibility they give them.

[omnipleasant]

"I just don't get people moaning and bleating that may think they're racist if they use racist languages in reference to somebody/like to buy racially caricature dolls.

If I had a 'yidboy' doll and referred to each and every jewish person I knew as 'the kike' I would expect people to probably think I was a bit anti-semetic. As well as rude."

Hehe. Absofcukinglutely. Pretty straightforward really, innit?