kog
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Post by kog on Feb 6, 2009 23:09:41 GMT
A large part of the Bible is about evil, bad people and bad happenings.
All defined by the Bible, and allowed to happen if the Pope or those below him say its ok to kill those people, because they don't believe in our God.
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Post by tarrant on Feb 6, 2009 23:12:27 GMT
so give us an answer! and not just the usual bullshit! tell me why good people die? even those who have prayed all thier lives and their chhildren pray all thier lives!!when they gonna have a GOOD LIFE! WHEN! What each of us experiences in our lives can often seem unfair, and frequently it is. With free will we can do pretty much as we choose, that means we can do things which we know are wrong as well as those which we believe to be right. It affects everyone equally. It's how we deal with these things within ourselves. I can't tell you there will be some reward because I really don't know. What I do know is that life is a lot easier if I try to do what I believe to be right. I feel better within myself. I hope, occasionally, I can do the same for others around me. Of course we are not supposed to judge either. We kill animals for food and germs and bacteria, so it does require some qualification. That too puzzled me. Some of the commandments do have qualification, the 4th for example, has a lot of qualification, we must not work more than one day in 7, neither must we cause anyone else to do so. But the 6th doesn't have qualifiication. It simply says don't kill. This was clatified by Jesus so there is no doubt. How can I not kill? I eat meat which means killing an animal. I eat plants which means killing them. My personal feeling is that this refers to other humans. You must do as you feel best. |
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Scooby Do
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Post by Scooby Do on Feb 6, 2009 23:16:05 GMT
Since Tony is a Roman Catholic, he can get away with anything. Only recently, I think he was "Paying his Premium" |
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Post by Libby on Feb 6, 2009 23:20:36 GMT
Quote from tarrant ~
What each of us experiences in our lives can often seem unfair, and frequently it is.
With free will we can do pretty much as we choose, that means we can do things which we know are wrong as well as those which we believe to be right.
It affects everyone equally.
It's how we deal with these things within ourselves.
I can't tell you there will be some reward because I really don't know.
What I do know is that life is a lot easier if I try to do what I believe to be right. I feel better within myself. I hope, occasionally, I can do the same for others around me.
well said tarrant! ;D I believe that too!
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Post by Marshall on Feb 6, 2009 23:27:32 GMT
The Bible is confusing because symbolic ideas are taken as literal and because it's inevitable whenever you try to create a dogma. The aim of true religion is to recognize something higher in yourself; exoteric religion does a pretty good job of making sure that doesn't happen.
The main idea of Yahweh is the idea of monotheism, i.e. that all things come from one source.
"Free will" is "free" in that we can do what we want. It isn't free in that we can escape the consequences of our actions.
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kog
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Post by kog on Feb 6, 2009 23:28:28 GMT
What I do know is that life is a lot easier if I try to do what I believe to be right. I feel better within myself. I hope, occasionally, I can do the same for others around me.
But are we realy doing what we believe to be right or are we doing what someone else has told us is right
Wasn't it said in the bible "An eye for an eye a tooth for a tooth"
How many of us believe that now.
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Post by Libby on Feb 6, 2009 23:34:10 GMT
We are not permitted to believe in an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth any more that's the problem. If we take the law into our own hands and play vigilante, it will be us who gets done for the crime and pays the price! That's a little outdated these days. I think we would like to believe in "payback" though, it's just not practical.
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Post by bertrus2 on Feb 6, 2009 23:34:55 GMT
With free will we can do pretty much as we choose, That is a truly idiotic statement. I 'want' to be Wimbledon champion, so 'Yes I can!'. |
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Scooby Do
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Post by Scooby Do on Feb 6, 2009 23:37:56 GMT
If we take the law into our own hands and play vigilante, it will be us who gets done
Thats because the establishment likes to be in charge. And you can't tell them anything, no matter how sensible your suggestion is.
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Post by Libby on Feb 6, 2009 23:38:37 GMT
I think tarrant meant we can choose freely, we have options.
That's how i interpret what he said. It makes sense to me.
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Post by Marshall on Feb 6, 2009 23:41:26 GMT
It makes sense to anyone who isn't being deliberately obtuse.
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kog
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Post by kog on Feb 6, 2009 23:44:51 GMT
I think tarrant meant we can choose freely, we have options.
And who gives us the options?
Truth is freedom is a myth
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Post by Libby on Feb 6, 2009 23:56:19 GMT
I'm just trying to work that one out kog! What exactly do you mean by that?!  |
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kog
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Post by kog on Feb 7, 2009 0:18:14 GMT
Freedom - the power to act or speak or think without externally imposed restraints
There is no situation I can think of were people have the power to act or think without restraint. Our freedom is restrained by people around us, by our environment and by nature itself. Ok there might be certain degrees of "freedom".
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Post by Libby on Feb 7, 2009 0:20:59 GMT
Ah ha, i'm with you now kog, thanks! ;D Now i understand. I will have to wait for tarrant to pop in and see if i got his comment right lol!  |
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Post by Marshall on Feb 7, 2009 0:30:50 GMT
Kog - even though there may be restraints in some (not all) courses of action it doesn't mean you can't choose. There are heavy restraints against murder yet people do it all the time because they've made the choice to.
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Post by tarrant on Feb 7, 2009 0:50:59 GMT
With free will we can do pretty much as we choose, That is a truly idiotic statement. I 'want' to be Wimbledon champion, so 'Yes I can!'. I don't know much about Wimbeldon, but I don't see any reason why you can't. Might be a bit of work though. Freedom - the power to act or speak or think without externally imposed restraints There is no situation I can think of were people have the power to act or think without restraint. Our freedom is restrained by people around us, by our environment and by nature itself. Ok there might be certain degrees of "freedom". I wasn't referring to freedom in that sense. I was referring to free will. That is the freedom to choose how you behave. You can choose, for example to be a murderer. If you never get the opportunity to murder is really doesn't make any difference since you have chosen to be what you are. Jesus made it clear to us that what is in our hearts is as important as what we do. This was His clarification and expansion of the 10 commandment. The freedom you get from free will is the freedom to decide what sort of person you wish to be. Achieving what you want is up to you. |
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Post by takemebacktolondon on Feb 7, 2009 11:06:55 GMT
Geez thats exactly what Tony Blair said but now he says he does .
He actually says also he "believes in the love of mankind"
Hes a real doozy of a war criminal isnt he .
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Post by bertrus2 on Feb 7, 2009 15:42:56 GMT
There are heavy restraints against murder yet people do it all the time because they've made the choice to. There are 16,000 murders a year in the United States. This is not 'all the time', in a population of 300 million. Do you really feel you're making a 'choice' not to murder your neighbour? |
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Post by bertrus2 on Feb 7, 2009 15:45:40 GMT
The freedom you get from free will is the freedom to decide what sort of person you wish to be. Would you really 'choose' to be executed by chemical injection or imprisoned for life? |
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