Tzipi wants your money

[bertrus2]

If she evades arrest for war crimes, Israeli Foreign Minister, Tzipi Livni, former Israeli army officer and Mossad operative and daughter of a noted Polish-born terrorist, will be in Brussels this evening to ask the 27 EU foreign ministers to contribute to stopping arms smugglng into Gaza. Do you think this would be a good use of your money?

[radge]

no we should give them all the weapons both sides need so tyhey can just wipe each other out, making the world a better place.

[VikingHumpingWitch]

Actually, yes. If they don't have any weapons in Gaza then Hamas won't be able to fire rockets into Israel in which case Israel will not invade Gaza, flatten most of it and kill lots of people. I think that would be a good thing.

[bertrus2]

It goes without saying that stopping smuggling would be a good thing. However, it would be naive to think that Israel wouldn't attack Gaza if there were no smuggling. For one thing there is the missing Israeli soldier, Gilad Shalit, on whose behalf quite a lot of destruction in Gaza was done before the recent Operation Warsaw Ghetto.

[reverend]

yeah vox pretty much hit the nail on the head, and bert hit the gutter as usual!

[Marshall]

Jan 21, 2009 19:03:41 GMT bertrus2 said:

It goes without saying that stopping smuggling would be a good thing.

If it goes without saying, then why start a thread inviting opinions on it?

[bertrus2]

If it goes without saying, then why start a thread inviting opinions on it?

For one thing, should we European taxpayers be paying for it?

[bertrus2]

bert hit the gutter as usual

Are you replying to voices in your head? Certainly not, sanely, to anything I posted.

[puffin]

Why is she asking the EU to pay for it?

[Marshall]

For one thing, should we European taxpayers be paying for it?
[/quote]

Oh, well I'm not qualified to answer that one then.

[bertrus2]

Why is she asking the EU to pay for it?T

The EU is a major contributor of aid to the Occupied Palestinian Territories. The EU pays and Israel destroys. The immediate concern is for urgent humanitarian aid. Israel control access to Gaza. The only airport, built with EU funds, was destroyed by Israel several years ago. There is an Israeli naval blockade which prevents access by sea. By land there is a perimeter fence patrolled by the Israeli army. The EU, or anybody else, can only deliver aid with Israeli permission. A condition imposed by Israel is co-operation on stopping smuggling. It's not clear what would be required exactly but troops, monitoring equipment costs money and the EU is being asked to participate.

"Livni said she had won an "understanding" during her two hours of talks with EU counterparts of the need to prevent smuggling of arms into Gaza from Egypt. However no details emerged during the news conference of how the EU and other international players could help counter such activities, given Egypt's reluctance to allow a foreign presence on its soil to carry out such tasks."
tinyurl.com/cadw5g

[newyorker]

"Tzipi wants your money"

Where do I send the check?

[reverend]

its going to be a race now for influence between saudi cash and iranian cash, anything from the EU is really just window dressing!

[bertrus2]

anything from the EU is really just window dressing!

It's so nice you take this lighthearted view of the hundreds of millions of euros that the EU has given in aid to Palestine. It's especially generous of you to make your contribution to infrastructure, such as Gaza Airport, which Israel then destroys.

[VikingHumpingWitch]

Given the bazillions of threads on Israel in recent weeks, I'd say Europeans (not including me) consider the place of interest. If we're going to say it's nothing to do with us why should we pay then could we please, please STFU about it altogether?

[radge]

let them both burn.

[reverend]

Jan 22, 2009 0:47:21 GMT bertrus2 said:

anything from the EU is really just window dressing!

It's so nice you take this lighthearted view of the hundreds of millions of euros that the EU has given in aid to Palestine. It's especially generous of you to make your contribution to infrastructure, such as Gaza Airport, which Israel then destroys.

geta life bert . not to mention a pair of glasses!

[bertrus2]

[i

]geta life bert . not to mention a pair of glasses!

[/i][/blockquote]

I'd need mind-reading equipment to know what you're talking about. The EU has been a leading contributor to infrastructure and humanitarian support of the Occupied Palestinian Territories. If you're generous enough not to care that Israel is sending the financial cost upwards by destroying infrastucture and strangling the economy of the Territories, I can't imagine why you are so careless of your own money.

[bertrus2]

could we please, please STFU about it altogether?

That's your decision. But the topic is interesting for a number of reasons.

The mass murder of Operation Warsaw Ghetto did make quite an impact in the media. (so, News General)

The inability of the UN to do anything about it, and throughout the history of the issue, shows that we're facing a failure on the scale of the collapse of the League of Nations, with the catastrophic consequences that that implies.

Also, the failure to implement international law points in the direction of very horrible worldwide conflict, up to and including nuclear war.

If we must have futile discussions, this is a good subject. Firstly, there is disagreement. Those working by double standards argue that what Israel does is good and the same thing done by the Palestinian resistance is bad. In the case of other terrible situations, the Congo, Darfur, there is no disagreement and, therefore, nothing to argue about, essentially.

[bertrus2]

let them both burn. radge

You are implying moral equvalence. There is no justification for that. Israel is a colonial power which is wiping Palestine off the map. Resistance to that isn't on the same moral level at all.