sweet soul
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Post by sweet soul on Jan 11, 2009 17:22:03 GMT
Yep, its sit and get shot or do something about it. If they did nothing they would be wrong . They got to defend and fight back. And why not too!
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Post by lawrence on Jan 11, 2009 19:10:36 GMT
Why don't the so-called Palestinian people just go back home to Jordan , Egypt , etc , wherever they came from ? No one is forcing them to stay there , in Israel , living in squalor and hate except themselves.
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Post by puffin on Jan 11, 2009 19:14:48 GMT
Hamas's rockets aren't capable of terrorising Israel. They're a nuisance, virtually a symbol of defiance. In ten years of blasting them out of Gaza, they've managed to kill a score of settlers with them - which is a day's work for the IDF in its current operation. Cllaiming that Hamas are terrorising Israel with these petards is absurd. lala, here's a hypothetical for you. I have a 357 magnum revolver (that's not hypothetical, I actually do, cool, huh  ), how about this, I'll randomly shoot it at your house, any time of day or night, a shot here, a couple shots there, you won't know when, but every day a bullet, or two, or three, will be sailing in through a window, I probably won't hit anyone shooting randomly like that, not capable of terrorising you and your family right? How long are you going to put up with it? Because the random shooting won't stop until you do something about it. Extend the hypothesis to the next step. I know that it's someone in the street that's firing at my house. I know that if I shoot into every place that I think they may be I'll probably manage to kill them, or if I don't I hope I'll make them too scared to fire at me again. To make sure the message goes home I go into the street with an oozie and blast the houses. I know I'm bound to kill or injure a lot of people who've done me no harm but I think it's worth it. How long do you keep firing when you see the results? The hard liners on both sides are getting just what they want from this. It's the poor civilians who are paying, and are likely to continue paying, for their intransigence and refusal to recognisee that both peoples have the right to exist and to live free from tension. |
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Post by cathy on Jan 11, 2009 19:20:34 GMT
Why don't the so-called Palestinian people just go back home to Jordan , Egypt , etc , wherever they came from ? No one is forcing them to stay there , in Israel , living in squalor and hate except themselves. Lawrence
The people living in Gaza have been there for years .. just as long or longer than most Israelis. Many of their families have lived in the same region for hundreds of years, so how can they go back to Jordon or Egypt or wherever else you'd like to see them go.
You might just as well say the Israelis should go back from whence they came ... ie ... Russia, the USA, etc.
Why are people so blinkered? Why can't they see that the Israeli/Palestinian conflict is caused by the few while the majority of people suffering are innocent bystanders who are in no position to stop it or get away from it.
The gates out of Gaza are firmly locked by Israel and Egypt.
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lala
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Post by lala on Jan 11, 2009 19:41:10 GMT
I also think it's a bit naive to think that simply handing back the occupied territories will bring a lasting peace. Giving up settlements won't be the end of it, but it would be the beginning of the end, to flirt with cliche. Israel should also make reperations to the Palestinians who were driven from their land and homes. The Arab countries should help in this, as s they contributed to the disasterous situation with their politicking and warmongering. A Truth & Reconcliation committee, SOuth Africa style also needs to be set up to investigate the whole sorry mess that is the regions history. First things first, though. SISrael needs to make a big move on the settlements, this will strengthen the moderates and cut off Hamas's support base far more effectively than trying to blast tit out of existance. Unless they kill every last Palestinian, there will always be someone else, enraged by watching their friends and families die. |
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lala
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Post by lala on Jan 11, 2009 19:48:49 GMT
Lala, yes i read what u said and im suprised at your views . Israel are acting in self defence ok. As i said, if Hamas was bombing Scotland day in day out you would be calling for the terrorists removal. If Scotland was being bombed continually, I'd want it to stop. That doesn't mean military response, however. I'd want to know why people were so angry with my country they wanted to attack it - especially if they were desperate enough to kill themselves in the process. I'd try to strengthen whatever voices of reason there were on the 'other side' instead of neutering them. If there was some MASSIVE AND UNDENIABLE historical grievance then I'd try to address it, to stop the hatred and the bombings. Actually, I'm condemning both sides. Both Hamas and the Israeli governemnent are ruthless, cuynical thugs, intent on strengthening their political positions through conflict. The only people supporting terrorism (literal definition) are the people justifying Israel's current attempt to destroy Hamas by brutalising the Palestinians. And you're one. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 11, 2009 19:51:21 GMT
Well some Israelis obviously still believe in 'winning' Yes that's the thing we, the allies did in WW2 with the help of America and Russia and the genius of Albert Einstein. Ho hum. At what point do you say that you have had enough of killing? If the leaders in Israel and the Gaza strip don't want peace yet, then it will go on. I don't see an end to it quite frankly  |
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lala
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Post by lala on Jan 11, 2009 19:56:32 GMT
How long are you going to put up with it? Because the random shooting won't stop until you do something about it. The comparison is not apt. A more accurate scenario is that I've driven your family out of your house so I can live there, forcing you all to live in the garage, and pretty much everything you once owned is now mine. Then I've moved my relatives into the garage, making it even more difficult for you. Occasionally, I send my big, tough brothers in to beat you and your relatives up, and sometimes set the dogs on you. This situation has been going on for years. Now some of your family are standing in the garage, throughing stones and firecrackers at the house. So I burn down the garage, killing or injuring your family. |
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lala
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Post by lala on Jan 11, 2009 20:01:06 GMT
Yep, its sit and get shot or do something about it. If they did nothing they would be wrong . They got to defend and fight back. And why not too! I agree they should do something. Like start giving up land on the West Bank. Weird how your list of options for doing something starts and ends with military action. Why shouldn't they fight back? Because force is only justifiable if it is going to be effective. It won't be in this case, because it will only make Hamas - or whatever organisation emergers in its wake - stronger, because there will be more angry, radicalised Palestinians convinced there's no point in trying to talk. |
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lala
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Post by lala on Jan 11, 2009 20:05:15 GMT
Why don't the so-called Palestinian people just go back home to Jordan , Egypt , etc , wherever they came from ? No one is forcing them to stay there , in Israel , living in squalor and hate except themselves. To draw on my earlier analogy, if someone threw you out of your house and forced you to live in the garage, and left you pretty much penniless, would you go and live with a stranger on the other side of town? Bearing in mind you can't even afford the bus fare to get there. |
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Post by slippylizard on Jan 11, 2009 22:02:36 GMT
Do you seriously think lala that if the Israel pulled out of Gaza and handed over the West Bank Hamas would be happy. I can't really imagine anyone from Hamas being "happy" anyway, do they do "Happy"? Well unless you are wearing a bomb vest and pull the chord on the right bus.
They never even indirectly had a go at us in Scotland. They (who are "they" exactly?) "They" blew a plane up that happened to be in Scotland.
No side is wholly correct here but firing rockets over a number of years is kind of asking for it is it not? As I said previously, I feel sorry for the people who are being misled and told this is the path to freedom.
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Post by newyorker on Jan 11, 2009 22:10:18 GMT
How long are you going to put up with it? Because the random shooting won't stop until you do something about it. The comparison is not apt. A more accurate scenario is that I've driven your family out of your house so I can live there, forcing you all to live in the garage, and pretty much everything you once owned is now mine. Then I've moved my relatives into the garage, making it even more difficult for you. Occasionally, I send my big, tough brothers in to beat you and your relatives up, and sometimes set the dogs on you. This situation has been going on for years. Now some of your family are standing in the garage, throughing stones and firecrackers at the house. So I burn down the garage, killing or injuring your family. Your comparison is not apt. It's like your family was squatting in my house, and I kicked you out into the house next door. Then from that house, you come back over to my property, and killed my dog, and shoot at my house from the street evry day. |
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lala
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Post by lala on Jan 12, 2009 1:47:32 GMT
Do you seriously think lala that if the Israel pulled out of Gaza and handed over the West Bank Hamas would be happy. I can't really imagine anyone from Hamas being "happy" anyway, do they do "Happy"? Well unless you are wearing a bomb vest and pull the chord on the right bus. It wouldn't really matter if they were happy or not. They'd quoickly find their support dwindling away. Then they'll be an irrelevancy, not supported by the majority of Palestinains, without a supply of would-be suicide bombers to draw on. As it is, the trickle of suice bombing vounteers will probably have become a stream after the last fortnight - which will suit Hamas perfectly. As I've said several times, Hamas have been 'asking for it' in an almost literal sense - this incursion suits them every bit as much as the Israeli government. Otherwise, they wouldn't have provoked it by recommencing rocket attacks. Talk about playing intot heir hands. Don't give your enemy what they want! As I said previously, I feel sorry for the people who are being misled and told this is the path to freedom.[/quote]And equally, you should feel sorry for the Israelis who are being mislead when they are told that this current spate of violence will bring then security or peace. It won't. It'll make things worse. |
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lala
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Post by lala on Jan 12, 2009 1:50:51 GMT
Your comparison is not apt. It's like your family was squatting in my house, and I kicked you out into the house next door. Then from that house, you come back over to my property, and killed my dog, and shoot at my house from the street evry day. Now you're just being silly - but what can we expect from someone who openly states he wants Arabs dead. Tell me, is there an age at which they become fair game, or does your genocidal hatred extend to infants? How, pray, were the Palestinians 'squatting'? |
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Post by newyorker on Jan 12, 2009 2:44:23 GMT
"How, pray, were the Palestinians 'squatting'?"
Simple, they're not from there, they're from Jordan, Egypt, arabs are from arabia, not Judea, you know, Judea, where they got the name Jews from, the place is also known as Israel.
Israel is for the Jews the same way China is for the Chinese.
Anybody that says otherwise is either an idiot or a God d*mned liar. And I mean God d*mned literally.
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wazwo
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Post by wazwo on Jan 12, 2009 7:05:13 GMT
slippylizard
'if Israel can defeat Hamas and keep the nutters at bay it may stand a chance of negotiating with semi reasonable people'
WAZWO
Sliiplizard how can you seperate The Palestinian People from this conflict when they teach their Kids hatred against Israel from Nursery School age onwards and thus provide Hammas with their future terrorists and suicide bombers?
The Palestinian people are as much to blame as Hammas.
The level of Anti-Semetic brainwashing propogada taught as part of the curriculum in Palestinian authority Schools and by Arab TV networks is tatamount to what the Nazis done inGermany.
How can this conflict be stopped given this situation?
The Palestinian People are right behind Hammas all the way as far as the elimination of Israel is concerned.
Sorry they have brought the problems they now have on their own heads.
It was I think Golda Meir that said 'when The Palestinians begin to love their children as much as they hate Israel then we will have peace'
I think She was right.
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lala
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Post by lala on Jan 12, 2009 7:42:48 GMT
Simple, they're not from there, they're from Jordan, Egypt, arabs are from arabia, not Judea, you know, Judea, where they got the name Jews from, the place is also known as Israel. Israel is for the Jews the same way China is for the Chinese. Anybody that says otherwise is either an idiot or a God d*mned liar. And I mean God d*mned literally. So you'll be packing your bags and heading back to Europe when, exactly? After all, Europeans aren't from America. |
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Post by rudeeric on Jan 12, 2009 9:31:35 GMT
Americas Israel should hang there heads in shame. killing innocent kids an stuff.
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Post by newyorker on Jan 12, 2009 10:08:48 GMT
Americas Israel should hang there heads in shame. killing innocent kids an stuff. Hey f**k you! I'm sick to death of the brain dead trying to villainize Israel and America, with their ill concieved thoughtess retarded positions. You go to Hamas and suck one of their terrorist d*cks you retarded cnut! F*cking terrorist lover! |
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Post by newyorker on Jan 12, 2009 10:11:13 GMT
Simple, they're not from there, they're from Jordan, Egypt, arabs are from arabia, not Judea, you know, Judea, where they got the name Jews from, the place is also known as Israel. Israel is for the Jews the same way China is for the Chinese. Anybody that says otherwise is either an idiot or a God d*mned liar. And I mean God d*mned literally. So you'll be packing your bags and heading back to Europe when, exactly? After all, Europeans aren't from America. No we feel the American Indians are occupiers, we'll be suicide bombing the American Indians, for their illegal occupation of their ancestral land, then we'll be launching rockets at them for the same reason. Then if they have the audacity to attack us to defend themselves, we'll piss and moan about our victimhood to a bunch of complete fu*king retards, you know, stupid cnuts that will reflexively take our side, because they have always hated Indians anyway, long history of anti-Indianism in the culture, so hey what the f*ck, they get to hate American Indians openly for a while without being called f*cking Nazi's. |
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