The migrants who just don't belong, by the Archbis

[sweet soul]

The migrants who just don't belong, by the Archbishop of York
Immigrants to Britain in the past five decades have been treated like hotel guests who 'do not belong', the Archbishop of York has said.
Dr John Sentamu said the failure of migrants to integrate had contributed to the collapse of a common British culture and the lack of a national sense of direction.
He called for recognition of the Christian heritage which used to bind the nation together and for a revival of the civic values once represented by myriad local clubs, churches and trade unions.

The Archbishop's powerful attack on uncontrolled immigration and on the Left-wing interpretation of multiculturalism that encourages migrants to ignore traditional British values, was made in a speech to Gordon Brown's think tank, the Smith Institute.

Dr Sentamu, a trustee of the Institute, has previously criticised multiculturalism and official neglect of the importance of Christian thinking and history.

But yesterday's speech was the first admission from a senior Church of England figure that large-scale immigration has brought serious problems as well as benefits.
Ugandan-born Dr Sentamu, who came to Britain in the 1970s, said it was important to remember that Britain had always provided refuge for economic migrants.
He said 250,000 Jewish people had come before the First World War, and had integrated and been accepted.

'What happened after the Second World War was a different phenomenon,' Dr Sentamu continued.

'For the first time, significant numbers of immigrants from a non Judaeo-Christian background settled in the UK.'

He referred to the view of Chief Rabbi Sir Jonathan Sacks that until the 1950s immigrants were like guests in a country house, who were expected to assimilate British values and to belong to the existing society.

But with the decline of empire and the growth of Commonwealth immigration, the pattern had become more like a hotel.

'Guests are entitled to stay if they can pay their way and receive basic services in return for their payment,' he said. 'But they are guests - they do not belong. In the same way, migrants to Britain from the 1960s onwards have made their home with their cultural rights protected under legislation framed under a multicultural perspective.

'Consequently, any sense of a shared common culture is eroded, risking increasing segregation.'

The Archbishop, who is second in the hierarchy of the Church of England, was speaking at a time when Mr Brown and his ministers have been increasingly prepared to acknowledge problems linked to immigration.
www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1114604/The-migrants-just-dont-belong-Archbishop-York.html

[sweet soul]

"Dr John Sentamu said the failure of migrants to integrate had contributed to the collapse of a common British culture and the lack of a national sense of direction." - Archbish


true? yes maybe!

[flatandy]

I think that's about the most wronig-headed thing I've ever read.

Wrong in almost all respects. That somehow all immigrants aren't belonging. That there once was a common British identity. That it was all defined by christian heritage. That we should all be more christian and that would make us more British (how ludicrous is that? British christianity was always largely a badge of convenience, not something sincere, not for a couple of centuries - if we were more christian and serious about it we'd be becoming American or Nigerian or something, not British).

The country house/hotel comparison is dribbling nonsense of the worst order.

The idea that "the Jews are OK, but everyone else isn't" is astonishingly offensive.

Frankly, if Dr Sentamu doesn't like it here he shouild fuck off back to where he came from.

[VikingHumpingWitch]

Isn't this the guy who said that you shouldn't wear a burqa on the street because you wouldn't wear it in somebody's house?

Are secular Brits not really Brits, then?

[ricklinc]

He was doing OK right up until this bit:

" He called for recognition of the Christian heritage which used to bind the nation together and for a revival of the civic values once represented by myriad local clubs, churches and trade unions. "

Completely lost me with that.

[Deleted]

Isn't he suggesting that today's immigrants come not to integrate but to bring their culture with them and to retain it within the structure of Britain's community whereas the exampled jews tried to integrate and in fact did, and that the new way is destroying Britain's culture by diffusing other cultures within it? If that is what he is saying I think we have to agree, because Britain's culture is a far different thing to what it was 50 years ago. What's nonsense about that? This is actually quite funny because all factions are not sure what to scream about because the one talking about a changing culture is himself black.

[flatandy]

Got to say that when I meander round certain bits of North London, particularly on a Friday evening, I'd not be entirely convinced that the Juice have made any more attempt to integrate than some of the Moose-limbs, say.

And yes, British culture has changed in the last 50 years. I think it's rather a good thing that British culture has changed, and think it would be quite, quite crap if we'd ossified into some hideous 1950s parody.

[radge]

Ahahahaha what a load of piss. They havent integrated so come to christianity to help them integrate!! ahahaha. as far as i can see apart from a few areas or small pockets, groups of people i would say the majority of immigrants have integrated very well. So quit trying to get people into your religion by talking pish about immigrants.

[Beachcomber]

He's an Archbishop and wants a return to 'Christian Values' 'cos he's worried about losing his power.

Perhaps he's planning a coup like the 'Mad Mullahs' in Iran

[VikingHumpingWitch]

Well, not all the Jews integrated, look at the hasidic Jews. I don't know what British culture is (and suspect it's as meaningless as claiming there's a shared EU culture) but I'm pretty sure it isn't going around wearing hats with ridiculous strings of beardy hair hanging down. Although, having said that, I've seen a fair few young Brits with hats and silly stringy beards, so maybe I'm wrong.

Secondly, if British culture hadn't moved on in 50 years we would have something to worry about. Lots of things have changed, we have the Internet now for example, not sure we can blame it on immies though.

For the record, just cos he is black doesn't mean he isn't talking offensive sh1t.

[flatandy]

Jan 14, 2009 13:01:06 GMT VikingHumpingWitch said:

For the record, just cos he is black doesn't mean he isn't talking offensive sh1t.

Indeed. I add him to the Trevor Phillips school of retarded reactionary almost-completely wrong Black People.

[ricklinc]

Change is always a good thing so long as it happens gradually enough. The social engineering types with the wet shoes have been trying to drag Britain kicking and screaming into their golden age utopia LSD flashback. Allowing unchecked immigration and doing daft stuff like printing everything they can in a million languages and screaming with outrage about any trivial insensitivity towards any culture that isn't English was always bound to cause hassle.

[radge]

VHW. your first point is true, but that what i mean, its such a small proportion of all immigrants that never integrate, so whats the issue, why are such a small minority gonna get me upset? as for the british culture thing, or british values. We have our laws and thats all that needs to be dealt with or worried about. The rest of it comes naturally.

[VikingHumpingWitch]

Jan 14, 2009 13:08:39 GMT radge said:

VHW. your first point is true, but that what i mean, its such a small proportion of all immigrants that never integrate, so whats the issue, why are such a small minority gonna get me upset? as for the british culture thing, or british values. We have our laws and thats all that needs to be dealt with or worried about. The rest of it comes naturally.

I agree totally.

Rick, I have to say (speaking as an evil immie myself), printing stuff in alternative languages isn't actually an inherently terrible thing. Obviously you need to look at the cost efficiency in each circumstance, but providing information to people is usually good, and if it can be done more effectively by printing some leaflets in Urdu or, in my case, English, then it's bloody helpful and much appreciated. I can honestly say that I wouldn't be in half so much shite regarding my taxes (basically, paying more than I need to) if it was possible to read the sodding forms in English. Sometimes it is in the country's advantage to provide the info and if it isn't being understood then that can be Bad. It's much easier to comply with requirements you are aware of.

[Deleted]

You lot just have to have something to scream about, don't you. What exactly is the rub here? What is it he's saying that offends you? I honestly don't see what any of you are on about. So we have some geezer who makes a statement about the state of our society - so what?

[radge]

cause hes a religious man trying to use immigration to get people into christianity. he's entitled to his opinion but keep your religion out of politics!

[VikingHumpingWitch]

To be honest, I'm most offended by his suggestion that we need more religion. The last thing I want to see is my country slipping backwards in the hideously mistaken belief that more supersitious nonsense will somehow do anything about the various unpleasantries associated with modern life.

The dig at immies is just a bit of popularism thrown in to get headlines.

[Deleted]

Oh right. I didn't read it that way. I thought he was making a statement of fact about society . Which happened to be unpalateable to some. So he's trying to say that... hang on, I'll go back and read it again...

[thenomad]

We might not need any more religion, but we definately do not need any more immigration.

We not allowed to keep foreigners from Europe out if their country has joined the EU for handouts, however, we should be very selective about anyone else we let in.

Oh and yes I do consider people from other EU countries to be foreigners because they that is what they are.

[ricklinc]

My dad was an evil immie. Sod all was printed in wop so he learnt to read and write English. When I was wandering around Germany in the middle of the night I was grateful for the number of Germans who spoke English and Italian and French but even though I was only there for a while I did make an effort to mispronounce my way through some of the local language. It's far too easy for some devout muslim to come to the UK and never even need to learn English. That can't be right. I'd have a very deep mistrust of someone who went to another country and couldn't even be bothered to learn the language. They'd ghetto up and assume that local laws were just for the local pale island dudes.

It's not about making things awkward for newcomers but some things shouldn't be too easy.