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Post by perrykneeham on Sept 15, 2019 18:21:18 GMT
Maybe put some aqueous cream on it?
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Post by flatandy on Sept 15, 2019 21:53:25 GMT
I still think that the conflict was both necessary and justified. I don't fully buy into that argument, but it's certainly one that can be easily made and impossible to refute. You could even argue that it was successful - if the goal was to prevent the dominoes falling, well, apart from Cambodia and Laos the dominoes didn't fall. Malaysia and Thailand and Burma and the Philippines and Indonesia and India did not turn Maoist. Therefore, if we're working on Kissinger's terms, it was a success. |
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voice
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Post by voice on Sept 16, 2019 0:14:53 GMT
yeah, but you're never gonna know for sure that Burma and the Philippines and Indonesia and India would not have not turned Maoist anyway.
and it was a war the US were never gonna win any more than the French did when they tried. Same as there is no winning in Afghanistan, the Taliban control more territory than ever.
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bertruss2
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Post by bertruss2 on Sept 16, 2019 6:57:43 GMT
True. But you have to consider what the point of such invasions is. The Taliban is the nationalist movement of the Pashtuns. There are 50 million of them and they are not just going to fade away. They are the largest tribe in Afghanistan but the majority of them live in Pakistan. Pashtunland was divided by the British into a Pakistan and an Afghan section.
The Americans have a different model of empire from the British. It doesn't involve moving in to occupy and administer the territory. The aim is to put in a native government which depends on American support. No need for Americans to be in the territory to have military control. At a press of a button they can send in the missiles from hundreds or thousands of miles away. Planes can fly in from bases in subordinate NATO countries in Europe and Turkey.
The success of these invasions is not to be measured in the occupation of territory. In the first place, it's a way of transferring American taxpayers money to the government budget, the Pentagon in particular. It also Makes America Great by terrorising its enemies and persuading its allies to co-operate. The financial benefits to American business, those in the arms and military support business, including computer business, are obvious.
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bertruss2
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Post by bertruss2 on Sept 16, 2019 9:36:47 GMT
With two exceptions, Canada and the United States, all NATO members, are in the EU, applicants to join, or associated through EFTA. It's difficult to do the obvious thing, get rid of the United States and rename and reform NATO into a European defence alliance.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 16, 2019 10:23:41 GMT
What's major about them apart from your need to prop up your silly student sloganeering? I don't see any killing as minor. You may, in the safety of your poncy little orangery in Sussex, but I see the aggressive actions of your warmongering heroes sad in the extreme. |
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moggyonspeed
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Post by moggyonspeed on Sept 16, 2019 11:05:32 GMT
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 16, 2019 11:13:14 GMT
In Johnson's defence, I see him as a bullshitter full of bluster and probably socially quite likeable. But introduced to the world of politics, yes, dense and destructive insofar as he's Cummings's poodle/bitch/lapdog/cocksucker spaniel/etc.
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moggyonspeed
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Post by moggyonspeed on Sept 16, 2019 11:17:38 GMT
"In Johnson's defence ..."
Don't tell me - he was left unsupervised! (As the famous T-shirt says).
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 16, 2019 11:34:50 GMT
...but with a nappy and bib.
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bertruss2
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Post by bertruss2 on Sept 16, 2019 11:54:26 GMT
Boris is in Luxembourg today for lunch with President Juncker at a well-known restaurant near the Luxembourg Parliament, Le Bouquet Garni. I don't expect he brought any useful political ideas to the table.
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moggyonspeed
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Post by moggyonspeed on Sept 16, 2019 11:56:38 GMT
Put it this way, if Juncker makes Johnson angry in any way, that table's days are numbered.
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bertruss2
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Post by bertruss2 on Sept 16, 2019 12:00:05 GMT
Boris arrives for lunch in Luxembourg.
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Post by Minge är en jävla besserwisser on Sept 16, 2019 12:04:11 GMT
Boris is in Luxembourg today for lunch with President Juncker at a well-known restaurant near the Luxembourg Parliament, Le Bouquet Garni. I don't expect he brought any useful political ideas to the table. just a bottle of whiskey for Juncker should see it through. |
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Post by perrykneeham on Sept 16, 2019 12:11:31 GMT
What's major about them apart from your need to prop up your silly student sloganeering? I don't see any killing as minor. You may, in the safety of your poncy little orangery in Sussex, but I see the aggressive actions of your warmongering heroes sad in the extreme. Waaaaaah! |
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Post by perrykneeham on Sept 16, 2019 12:20:16 GMT
With two exceptions, Canada and the United States, all NATO members, are in the EU, applicants to join, or associated through EFTA. It's difficult to do the obvious thing, get rid of the United States and rename and reform NATO into a European defence alliance. Why would you do that? Who will underwrite it? |
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mids
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Post by mids on Sept 16, 2019 12:51:57 GMT
I still think that the conflict was both necessary and justified. I don't fully buy into that argument, but it's certainly one that can be easily made and impossible to refute. You could even argue that it was successful - if the goal was to prevent the dominoes falling, well, apart from Cambodia and Laos the dominoes didn't fall. Malaysia and Thailand and Burma and the Philippines and Indonesia and India did not turn Maoist. Therefore, if we're working on Kissinger's terms, it was a success. Did you know that we more or less won the 1st Vietnam war in the immediate aftermath of WW2? Britain, the Indian army and surrendered Japanese troops took on the viet Minh and battered them. Unfortunately we then all left and they came back. Weird to think that British were fighting alongside Japs just months after fighting them. |
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Post by perrykneeham on Sept 16, 2019 12:53:41 GMT
Also, the French successfully ran Indochina for generations.
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Post by jimboky on Sept 16, 2019 13:01:42 GMT
With two exceptions, Canada and the United States, all NATO members, are in the EU, applicants to join, or associated through EFTA. It's difficult to do the obvious thing, get rid of the United States and rename and reform NATO into a European defence alliance. sounds good to me |
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Post by flatandy on Sept 16, 2019 13:11:19 GMT
Also, the French successfully ran Indochina for generations. Erm.... |
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