Scooby Do
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Where's my pic?
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Post by Scooby Do on Apr 13, 2009 21:26:23 GMT
Really? Who, save me the time, I'm an idle sod ;D
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Post by pinxminx on Apr 13, 2009 21:28:02 GMT
No soz I just got confused a while back! The thread is going too fast. I'm sorry Scooby Doo. <smiles>
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mistressdao
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K1, sl1 k2tog psso, yf k1, yf k3
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Post by mistressdao on Apr 14, 2009 6:53:39 GMT
I really don't know the answer to this. I could make some suggestions.
All children should attend nursery this could give them a good start on learning acceptable behaviour, it may ensure that are able to communicate with their peers and adults.
Nursery education is a good foundation, takes them from the baby sitting TV, engages them in play, gives their imagination room to move. It would bring them into contact with adults who will talk and read to them.
Clear guidelines from an early age need to be set for children, yes I know many parents seem incapable of this. Is this where we say some people should never have children, bear in mind that it is not just what you lot call chavs who drag up obnoxious brats - bad behaviour goes across all social groups.
Teachers need to be able to get back into engaging and inspiring education rather than the narrow test ridden national curriculum we now have and parents need to understand the value of education.
I do baulk at the idea of teaching parents to be parents but maybe I have to put some of my suspicion and dislike for societal norms aside and agree that either we have a programme of parental guidance or stop certain people from reproducing.
ok I have run out of steam now
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 14, 2009 8:43:18 GMT
It's too late to reintroduce caning; mentalities have changed. You'd have to stop child benefit to the parents of psychopath kids, or something like that. Dunno really. UK society's had it. Be nice to flog them but you can't.
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ricklinc
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Nostalgia
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Post by ricklinc on Apr 14, 2009 9:10:47 GMT
Governments seem to like treating people as special. Special cases, special needs, etc. So special schools. Borstal without the kindness and sympathy. No doubt someone will immediately yammer about violations of human rights. Scrap 'em. What's Brussels going to do? Invade?
Irresponsible parents can do some hard time as well. And there has got to be some punishment of the lefty dweebs who made all this possible. That Warnock pregnant dog needs a good slapping. By her own admission she gave governments bad advice that was followed. She making up for that now? What about her mates?
This is all kneejerk reaction stuff. But after years of moderation, studies, ineffectual spin gimmicks and doing nothing serious because it would upset the wet wipes perhaps it's time to just get angry and do something precipitate.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 14, 2009 9:14:51 GMT
Bring back HM training ships. Now there's a thought - out of sight, out of mind, and the real bastards go overboard.
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Post by vania on Apr 14, 2009 9:39:16 GMT
Not sure I agree with it being even an option, in schools at least. What is your alternative Vania? All other routes of discipline that do not involve a stick.
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ricklinc
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Post by ricklinc on Apr 14, 2009 10:37:06 GMT
I never liked the stick idea. But it was quick and easy and it worked. For thousands of years. That is the best reason possible for doing something. It's the only real reason that matters. Everything else is just bullsh1t. Whether or not something works is the only consideration that counts. Why is that so hard for some people to understand?
This is why liberals should be hunted down and shot. If they can find something that works then go to it and good luck. Until then they shouldn't have interfered.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 14, 2009 10:55:23 GMT
How about gas chambers? They worked remarkably well, although there was a spinoff frenzy which tends to get on one's tits.
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Post by vania on Apr 14, 2009 11:00:07 GMT
" But it was quick and easy and it worked."
Did it. Was it solely the stick that worked? Do other countries without the stick in classes have problems with kiddy behaviour?
What about British schools without issues with unruly children. Are they sneakily using the stick?
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ricklinc
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Post by ricklinc on Apr 14, 2009 11:40:51 GMT
British schools without issues with unruly children. Possibly because these schools have pupils from families with parents who already did the work of teaching the children something about discipline and respect. For the schools less fortunate you would suggest what? Quiet time. Isolation. The Naughty Corner.
You don't really understand what the cane was about. It wasn't the pain that was the deterrent. It was the shame. It was the fear of humiliation. I was at a Jesuit boarding school where canings were regular and impersonal. Any teacher could send you for cracks and you had to write out a receipt for the duty caner's signature. We were a bunch of lads far from home and parents. We were all fit, fed and exercised into great condition with lots of energy and a million ways to screw up. Naturally were going to get into fights, torch the outbuildings and shoot at the squirrels. But our behaviour was moderated to at least reflect that we understood that actions had consequences. Other schools were different. Canings happened but rarely because the kids knew it was a possibility and didn't want any.
Schools nowadays can function for as long as the pupils don't know that teachers have very little recourse when kids act up. Teachers that do try to impose what passes for punishment often get a visit from parents being cnuts about it. Kid with parents who aren't so cnutish are at a huge disadvantage because teachers learn that these kids can be safely punished.
You don't get just how messed up everything is. Courtesy stupid theories forced into practice by the people least qualified to make any kind of decisions.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 14, 2009 11:52:38 GMT
I'm all for caning. And for any holistically inclined or 'spiritually' conscious objectors, buddhist monks cane their acolytes quite regularly, so it's allowed.
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Post by vania on Apr 14, 2009 11:57:04 GMT
I think there is caning and caning in schools which many would argue are two different things.
Anyway maybe it should be a vote for parents to make. Those who are happy for their kids to be caned by teachers can agree, those who aren't can opt out.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 14, 2009 12:21:21 GMT
Our headmaster used to feel our arses before caning them to make sure we weren't wearing protection. Last time I was caned with a group of friends for getting drunk we were all pissing ourselves with laughter. Took it like real men we did.
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Post by cobblers on Apr 14, 2009 12:46:39 GMT
There is a good reason they don't use them. If they do they are branded as being unable to control the kids,no matter how unfair that may be, and their careers are blighted forever. Heads just won't listen to a teacher who voices concern about a particular pupil for the same reasons. Branded as unable to control their kids if they use the cane? Very good way of controlling kids. Teachers get assaulted by pupils - I suppose the fault lies with the teachers then too? I was whacked at school. As long as the sadist teachers are kept in check (there were two at mine, neither of whom whacked - one, Mr Harrison would pull the hair above and in front of the ear in a circular motion and the other Mr Richardson used to terrorise by throwing chisels and shouting). Mr Ingram would whack us for every mistake in Latin translation, I don't bear him any ill will and we were all getting 98%. We all knew that stepping out of line meant only one thing and consequently we did not step out of line.Other methods of control now would be detention etc where there is even more scope for backchat/winding teachers up. I don't think I'd have a problem with my child getting a whack, formally administered and not by a sadist, if he was being a little sh*t. Catch such behaviour early and it is unlikely to be repeated, let alone become routine. I know what we were like at school, and I regret to say we wound up the weaker more peaceful teachers regardless of whether they were nice or not, and regardless of whether or not I would respect them now as an adult.
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Post by bertrus2 on Apr 14, 2009 14:26:57 GMT
I was whacked at school. As long as the sadist teachers are kept in check (there were two at mine, neither of whom whacked - one, Mr Harrison would pull the hair above and in front of the ear in a circular motion and the other Mr Richardson used to terrorise by throwing chisels and shouting). Mr Ingram would whack us for every mistake in Latin translation, This explains your unwholesome respect for authority.
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dwad
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Post by dwad on Apr 14, 2009 14:30:39 GMT
There is a good reason they don't use them. If they do they are branded as being unable to control the kids,no matter how unfair that may be, and their careers are blighted forever. Heads just won't listen to a teacher who voices concern about a particular pupil for the same reasons. Branded as unable to control their kids if they use the cane? Very good way of controlling kids. Teachers get assaulted by pupils - I suppose the fault lies with the teachers then too? I was whacked at school. As long as the sadist teachers are kept in check (there were two at mine, neither of whom whacked - one, Mr Harrison would pull the hair above and in front of the ear in a circular motion and the other Mr Richardson used to terrorise by throwing chisels and shouting). Mr Ingram would whack us for every mistake in Latin translation, I don't bear him any ill will and we were all getting 98%. We all knew that stepping out of line meant only one thing and consequently we did not step out of line.Other methods of control now would be detention etc where there is even more scope for backchat/winding teachers up. I don't think I'd have a problem with my child getting a whack, formally administered and not by a sadist, if he was being a little sh*t. Catch such behaviour early and it is unlikely to be repeated, let alone become routine. I know what we were like at school, and I regret to say we wound up the weaker more peaceful teachers regardless of whether they were nice or not, and regardless of whether or not I would respect them now as an adult. What school was that Cobbs? I fear we may have overlapped with Mr Richardson the chisel thrower...?
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dwad
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Post by dwad on Apr 14, 2009 14:38:26 GMT
Indeed, Mr Harrison was my much loved form teacher and Ingram a true great. Are you an OD?
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dwad
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Post by dwad on Apr 14, 2009 14:55:27 GMT
Yes Dwad! Was actually Putty who used to whack us for Latin, but I used some artistic license. Mr Harrison was a sadist, hated that man with his yellow glasses lenses. And Mr Richardson who was borderline psychopathic. How old are you? 30 - sounds like we had all the same masters - they did stick around there. Inky, Guv, Putty, Pully and Parny all taught my dad as well. You don't get names like that at other schools. I actually rather liked Mr Harrison's "physicality" - always done with a knowing irony. Mr Richardson was frightening, I remember somebody laughing at his stammer once. Bad idea. Although that said, out of school in a good mood, he was actually quite nice. I suppose as an 8-year old you build up stereotype horror images. Never actually had Putty for any lessons but always enjoyed a rendition of "poor old upper 2B" at the sing-song.
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Post by cobblers on Apr 14, 2009 15:03:51 GMT
And what about Ma and Pa Wyeth-Webb? If you heard that you'd be like 'Who?' I'm 34 so chances are we were there at the same time.
'Roll up! Roll up! Swindle show!' Does that ring any bells?
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