Norwegians doctors involved in Hamas propaganda

[cobblers]

"There should be journalists here" which suggests that he would welcome independent witnesses.

Or was calculated to bolster his credibility. 'I'm the only one here, so you'll have to trust me. I'd love there to be other 'independent' witnesses, but I'm the only independent one here so I'll have to do.'

Look beyond the surface. Hamas knew this was coming, they planned it this way. You are being presented with a carefully orchestrated bit of propaganda.

[cobblers]

Look up Mads Gilbert VHW.

[VikingHumpingWitch]

Jan 14, 2009 10:45:50 GMT @cobblers said:

Look up Mads Gilbert VHW.

Why are you deliberately conflating the two? I am talking about Erik Fosse, because that's who the interview was with.

[cobblers]

I'm conflating the two because they are both there with the same organisation and I believe the same agenda.

[Deleted]

As much as I'd like to believe the poster's insistance on a false picture being presented to us - how nice if no-one were really being hurt and that it was all a big hamas hoax - I have absolutely zero faith in the poster's equanimity. He's sort of shot himself in the foot with his incessant ranting about the evil of all things muslim - which is a shame because I despise hamas and all it stands for.

[VikingHumpingWitch]

Interesting. A quick shufty on the NORWAC website says that they are funded partly by donations from the Norwegian government - are you suggesting that the Norwegian government is party to colluding in Hamas propaganda? Also I note that you say they are predominantly active in Islamic countries as if this throws some suspicion on them. Again, a look at the website shows that this is because their first project was in the Lebanon following the Isreali invasion in the early 80s. In 1999 they were active in the Balkans, I can only guess that a humanitarian aid organisation feels its work is most effective and needed in countries where there are wars and that sort of thing going on.

I think you should stop accepting what you read on slightly crackpot websites as total truth and do a bit of investigating of your own. You just can't trust what anyone says about Israelistine and anything connected to it.

[cobblers]

And you don't think Hamas is running things in Gaza now? What goes out to the world? Hamas orchestrated this whole affair. They knew they could force israel to act and they knew the Pr potential of inflating civilian casualties and accentuating Israeli 'war crimes'.

another thing - the UN. Were you aware that the largest voting block in the UN is the OIC?

[cobblers]

"you say they are predominantly active in Islamic countries as if this throws some suspicion on them. Again, a look at the website shows that this is because their first project was in the Lebanon following the Isreali invasion in the early 80s. In 1999 they were active in the Balkans, I can only guess that a humanitarian aid organisation feels its work is most effective and needed in countries where there are wars and that sort of thing going on."

Darfur, for example?

[cobblers]

VHW I think you should look at the second video 'staged? or not?'

again, 'women and children on the roof' - while, we hear, Hamas are in underground bunkers. Look at the procession of completely unharmed-looking children being unloaded from the taxi.

[sweet soul]

Cobbs the pic in your profile is a still pic here on this pc im using, but when i log on here using my mobile phone, i see the pic as a moving vidieo ...cute kitty boxing.

[Deleted]

Those childish moving pics are distracting. If anything's going to stop me visiting news general it'll be that...

[cobblers]

That's me Sweetsoul!

VHW, in my experience arguing with you and others merely makes you harden your position. Keep an open mind, revisit the videos and follow this stroy (if only in the interests of proving yourself right)

Still I can't believe you;re taken in by the fake grief, the fake blood, the burying of a muslim body that hasn't been washed and the death of a brother filmed by his brother. When the doctor announces the 'death' he carries right on filming.

[sweet soul]

You are a cute kitten?
hehehehehe!!

[cobblers]

Second Youtube video, another incident with children playing on the roof. Is that crazy or what?

Check the children getting out of the taxi @ 0:53. Anyone see genuine-looking injuries? Why aren't they being carried into the hospital?

Next, the statistic he quotes:

@ 1:38 only one military person killed

[VikingHumpingWitch]

Jan 14, 2009 11:11:55 GMT @cobblers said:

That's me Sweetsoul!

VHW, in my experience arguing with you and others merely makes you harden your position. Keep an open mind, revisit the videos and follow this stroy (if only in the interests of proving yourself right)

Still I can't believe you;re taken in by the fake grief, the fake blood, the burying of a muslim body that hasn't been washed and the death of a brother filmed by his brother. When the doctor announces the 'death' he carries right on filming.

Sentence one wins "mirror mirror" award of the day!

OK, I watched the second video. What are you claiming was faked here? The ruined building looked pretty convincing to me and in all honesty I doubt even Hamas has the inclination, let alone time or money, to build a film set of a bombed out building. Even if they did, I would expect that unless the IDF are bombing using flour there are probably some real ruined buildings they could have used.

People turning up injured to a hospital also seems pretty run of the mill stuff. Were there any in particular who in your expert medical opinion were just time wasting barstewards?

I have no doubt Hamas is exploiting the victims and as I keep saying, I don't unquestioningly believe anything either "side" says about anything. That does of course mean that I also see through your attempts at propaganda, such as the "one Norwegian doctor is a dodgy commie so anyone who works for or with NORWAC also must be" ruse.

[waldo]

Curious that the subject should be propaganda.
There was a discussion on the Beeb this morning, it would appear that The Israelis have completely misjudged the propaganda side of the war. They are losing

regarding the photographs: the heavy munitions being used by the Israelis converts a child to a bucket of red brown slush --

Nobody will feel sorry for a bucket of pieces.

Hamas have obviously used only the most effective images.

Not many people have the deep forensic ability to analyse the images like Cobblers and so they are effective against the background as follows:

the IDF have corroborated the numbers of child dead but have said "Blame Hamas"
you have Jewish grandfathers like Avi openly rejoicing at "one less terrorist family"
The wealth and influence of the jewish community in communications is well known and so their propaganda carries less weight
The message to all from the Israeli side seems to be "Blame Hamas", lack of variation makes it seem all too pat.
The military opinions would appear to say that the invasion will not provide a solution but will exacerbate the problem.

etc

the score would appear to be a near draw on the military war, Israel 6/Palestine 4
the propaganda war would show the Palestinians way out in front Israel 3/ Palestine 7

[cobblers]

The children getting out of the taxi and being shepherded along in front of the cameras.

I don't doubt the building was destroyed or that there are civilian casualties. I am not saying there are no casualties, only that in these two examples there are bits of film that look staged.

As for Norwac, many charities receive funding from the government without checks on what they do. The UK Charities Commission has come under criticism for not checking out the organisations it approves.

And don't you find the NORWAC wesbite remotely odd? The use of the word 'solidarity' for example? The fact that it does not do humanitarian work anywhere in Africa or Asia for example, despite its claim that "Our work is based on the principle of solidarity and equality regardless of religion, race and ethnic belonging."

Don't you at least think it suspect that Gilbert is refferred to as 'independent' in light of his trotting out of Hamas propaganda and his stated position on 9/11?

How come certain civilians (US ones) had it coming to them (despite the fact that none of them were firing rockets), but what is happening in Gaza is all because of the war criminals Israel?

[VikingHumpingWitch]

The full text, which again you have oddly chosen to edit down, is " Our work is based on the principle of solidarity and equality regardless of religion, race and ethnic belonging."

No, I find nothing odd in that. Also bear in mind that Norway is a small country, NORWAC probably just doesn't have the resources to be everywhere at once.

Your questions directed to Mats Gilbert are best answered by him. I have never met the man so I feel unqualified to respond on his opinions.

What I find odder than all of that is the idea that they would need to stage deaths. We can, I assume, all agree that there are civilian casualties, so why bother going to this trouble to fake them? Wouldn't it be more effective PR to use, you know, undeniably dead people?

This thread has tinfoil written all over it. No offence.

[mids]

NORWAC says one of its partners is the "Martyr Foundation". Wonder what that is.

[VikingHumpingWitch]

Now that at least does sound sus.