Banksy's latest

[flatandy]

Dec 13, 2015 19:24:27 GMT auldhippy said:

Pictures are always art.

Really?

[Deleted]

"No I'm not arguing that other than it's a high profile artistic symbol of migration being a good thing. Most considered arguments do fall on the side of immigration being good." OH

Well, no. Immigration's immigration. Whether it's 'good' or 'bad' depends on many things. To some it's 'good', to others 'bad'.

[auldhippy]

Dec 14, 2015 16:11:28 GMT flatandy said:

Dec 13, 2015 19:24:27 GMT auldhippy said:

Pictures are always art.

Really?

Yes, good or bad but art.

[auldhippy]

Dec 14, 2015 16:29:21 GMT @oneofthelessergods said:

"No I'm not arguing that other than it's a high profile artistic symbol of migration being a good thing. Most considered arguments do fall on the side of immigration being good." OH

Well, no. Immigration's immigration. Whether it's 'good' or 'bad' depends on many things. To some it's 'good', to others 'bad'.

An argument you're never tired of losing.

[Deleted]

As opposed to yours? Come on - how can immigration be 'good'? I don't want an example but an explanation as to why immigration is intrinsically 'good'.

And try to remember that European Jews immigrated into Palestine; Europeans into North America; Spaniards into South America; English into Australasia. And so on. Was it 'good' for the locals when they turned up?

[flatandy]

Dec 14, 2015 16:30:05 GMT auldhippy said:

Dec 14, 2015 16:11:28 GMT flatandy said:

Really?

Yes, good or bad but art.

Nonsense.

[auldhippy]

Explain please.

[flatandy]

A photo take accidentally of my finger isn't art.

A diagram of a DNA helix isn't art.

Many pictures aren't art, in and of themselves. They need to be placed in such a context that they have meaning for them to be art...

[wetkingcanute]

If you accept that there is a difference between "Art" and "Craft" then it is quite possible to say that not all pictures are art.

A lot of craft can be "artistic".

But if we apply the word "Art" to everything that somebody, often the artist, says is art - then the word loses any meaning.

[flatandy]

I think it's true that almost every picture, in the right context, can be art.

Although that doesn't mean it's good art, obviously...

[auldhippy]

Dec 14, 2015 17:03:38 GMT flatandy said:

A photo take accidentally of my finger isn't art.

A diagram of a DNA helix isn't art.

Many pictures aren't art, in and of themselves. They need to be placed in such a context that they have meaning for them to be art...

It's still a picture of a finger & someone could find it artistic, at worst it's bad art and often good art isn't intentional. All photography is art, good or bad.

A diagram is an example of design & therefore art

Context can be added by the viewer, look at modern abstract, the context offered by the artist isn't necessarily the same context seen by the viewer.

All pictures are art.

[auldhippy]

Dec 14, 2015 17:07:08 GMT wetkingcanute said:

If you accept that there is a difference between "Art" and "Craft" then it is quite possible to say that not all pictures are art.

A lot of craft can be "artistic".

But if we apply the word "Art" to everything that somebody, often the artist, says is art - then the word loses any meaning.

Craft is art, absolutely. "Arts & crafts" bed mates.

Meaning can prefaced by an adjective, good art or bad art. The finger paints by your grandbrats now adorning your fridge is art but you wouldn't dream of telling your grandbrats it isn't, neither would you expect anyone else to think it artistic.

Its a small word but amazingly all encompassing.

[eit]

Dec 12, 2015 19:35:57 GMT flatandy said:

So, the amount someone's art fetches at auction defines how worthwhile their art is? That's a very un-hippy way of looking at it....

... and a poor way to measure art.

How do you value the ceiling of the Sistine Chapel or the Wilmington Man (the man with the big willy)?
    

[auldhippy]

I point out that I'm debating merit not value though I have used value in my argument, hard to argue something worth 6 figures has no merit.

THis piece could be worth similar to all the others but would be devalued because no one is going to buy the flyover it's adorning so it's actual value is possibly nought. Considerable merit though because of the concept and that it's one of the very few attempts at portraiture by Banksy.

[eit]

[auldhippy]

It's a picture, it's art.

[nobody]

Have to agree with hippy.

[eit]

Congratulations. The Spaghetti Monster loves you.

[Repat Van]

Dec 14, 2015 11:52:02 GMT auldhippy said:

No I'm not arguing that other than it's a high profile artistic symbol of migration being a good thing. Most considered arguments do fall on the side of immigration being good. Really I'm just defending the merits of a work of conceptual art. If he wanted to make the reverse point as you suggest he would have needed an infamous and highly recognisable murderer. Jobs is a spectacularly successful example and is even more conceptually relevant because his old man came from Homms and part of the concept is the location of the work, ie the Jungle where refugees, possibly from Homms, are gathered. If he were just after a successful son of an immigrant he could have used Trump (shudder). Presumably Banksy had to research Jobs unless he knew his father came from Homms, unlikely, my point is Banksy delves deep for his concepts.

But it's a daft argument using the example of one child of immigrants who is a success to argue that means immigration is good. Like I've said you could do the same argument in reverse and it would be just as daft.

Anyway that aside I hadn't realised how super pretentious you are.
You learn something new everyday.

[auldhippy]

I have faith in you, like yoghurt you will eventually develope culture.