US Supreme Court, women's bodily autonomy cancelled

[happyhammerhead]

Jul 17, 2022 15:52:46 GMT jimboky said:

but they DO want to impose on us, that's the point, I wouldn't have known or cared they existed if they were not in our face, I don't care of you cut off your body parts and pretend to be whatever, hell you can pretend to be a horse for all I care, just leave me alone

It's already been said of course, but seriously, WTAF?

What's 'in our face'?

I get there's some controversy with trans in sports. That, given I'm not that fussed, will leave it to those who care.

A couple of my daughter's friends wanted to trans. Gotta admit the NHS were great, lots of support and both eventually decided their problems didn't reside in gender. Not making a judgement there - merely appreciating they gave the kids the time to think things through.

Point being - aside from a mild interest - don't see any reason I can't go through my entire life not thinking trans issues are forced upon me.

[voice]

I suspect for the likes of Jim and the other transobsessives, just realizing trans people exist is an imposition.

[Repat Van]

Anyway back on topic….

In news that will surprise precisely nobody:

“ Texas hospitals are refusing to see people with serious pregnancy issues for fear of violating post-Roe abortion ban, medical group says

Some Texas hospitals are reportedly refusing to treat people with severe pregnancy complications for fear that they will violate the state's strict abortion ban, the Texas Medical Association said, according to the Dallas Morning News.

In a letter to the Texas Medical Board seen by the newspaper, the association said it had received numerous complaints that hospitals were blocking doctors from giving pregnant people medically necessary care, which includes ending a pregnancy.

According to the paper, the letter described one case of a woman who had an ectopic pregnancy — a pregnancy that grows in the fallopian tubes and will never be viable, but will be life-threatening. She was said to have been refused treatment until her pregnancy ruptured.

"Delayed or prevented care in this scenario creates a substantial risk for the patient's future reproductive ability and poses a serious risk to the patient's immediate physical wellbeing," the letter said, the Dallas Morning News reported.“


www.businessinsider.com/texas-abortion%20hospitals-refusing-treat-serious-pregnancy-issues-fear-report-2022-7?r=US&IR=T

Pro-life my arse.

[voice]

Oh yeah, women dying is of no concern to these extremists, it's about control first and foremost.

[Repat Van]

Jul 17, 2022 16:46:12 GMT voice said:

Also apart from equality legislation there is nothing promoting or imposing trans issues, yet the amount of anti trans legislation by the right is vast from prosecuting Dr's and patents who seek to help trans kids, to exclusion from all manner places and such to banning of books that even dare mention trans and gay people even exist. The ones doing the imposing are not the majority Jim, it's your lot.

All of this. But conservatives somehow never see their legislation as imposing themselves on others.

Reminds of the marriage equality vote in Oz. Gay people wanting to marry was apparently imposing their beliefs on Christian folk. But Christian folk supporting a constitutional amendment preventing gays marrying is not imposing their beliefs on others.

[perrykneeham]

Bear in mind, America. Not wonderful, sun-dappled, inclusive, progressive UK. Here, you can pretend to be a strawberry if you like.

[happyhammerhead]

I frequently do, and it's not even a berry.

[perrykneeham]

Ah. Le mot juste.

[voice]

Wow, there was a referendum in deep deep republican Kansas tonight trying to outlaw all abortion in that state, it was resoundingly defeated 62% to 38%. Despite every attempt to game the vote, sending misleading text messages on voting day and a deliberately confusing question, the extremists got their arse handed to them.

[flatandy]

Yes. Absolutely great result in Kansas for all kinds of reasons.

Mostly because it actually protects Kansans (and means that people in adjacent states which are trying to ban - or have banned - abortion have a lot less far to travel for their healthcare).
But also because it says that trying to game the vote doesn't always work
Also because it means that the public as a whole, even Republicans in a red state, are against abortion bans and other crazy actions by the culture warriors
And finally there was a very high turnout which suggests that Roe v Wade could well drive something of a turnout increase among anti-extremism voters in the next couple of elections.

[jimboky]

all this proves is that the States can work this out without the feds, people in Kansas, and every other state can settle this for their state, Federalism works,

[voice]

The problem with that Jim is the extremists in many other red states would never allow a vote on this cos they know theyd loose, Kanata only did it cos it was the only way they could ban abortion, by overturning the state constitution.

[jimboky]

every state elects their government, there will be "Pro Choice" in every election,

[flatandy]

State elections are not exactly democratic, of course. And in many states there isn't a process available like the Kansas one.

The Kansas one, ironically, was an attempt by the anti-choice/anti-health side of the argument. If every state had to have a referendum like the Kansas one, to choose whether to ban abortion, I'd expect similar results in probably 40+ states. But in some states - say, Florida - the requirement for a constitutional amendment is a 60%+ majority, and currently in place is an anti-health government.

But that ignores the main fact that the federal government's duty is to protect the lives and health of its citizens, and therefore there should be a national federal requirement to permit abortion.

[jimboky]

But that ignores the main fact that the federal government's duty is to protect the lives and health of its citizens,


no is isn't, that goes to the state, medical is always controlled by state, every state licenses Doctors, Nurses, Hospitals, all medical, my wife has had license in all states, never had one from the feds,

[flatandy]

14th amendment says otherwise. Declaration of Independence "Life, Liberty, Pursuit of Happiness" says otherwise.

Are you really saying the national government shouldn't care if its citizens die due to malpractice by state legislatures?

[jimboky]

I'm saying that medical has always been left to the state, there is no federal control of anything medical, it is the state, it has always been the state,
all the feds can do is give grants to get the state to do whatever, they have influence, but the final call is the state

how does the 14th apply? see the 10th

[voice]

In cases where the state puts the life of its citizens in danger, federal law takes precedence. It's why Illinois is being sued for risking the life of women and why Bidens orders on life saving treatment being everyone's rights take precedence over the laws the extremists have put in place to kill women and prosecute those who might try and save their life.

[jimboky]

what are you talking about? Illinois is full Pro-Choice, nothing has changed there,

if you were to come to the USA to nurse then you would get license from the state you worked in, states have always controlled all things medical

[voice]

Sorry must be one of the other US Taliban states getting sued for endangering women's health.

And yes states control most aspects of health, but the feds can step in to protect women being put at danger by Vanilla ISIS and to stop vexatious prosecution of Dr's, who save women's life's, by the extremists.

And getting back to your point about voting for pro bodily autonomy candidates, well as you know, due to the gerrymandering many of the insane states have built in one party rule, and we know non of those will ever put this to a statewide referendum unless forced to, because if they can loose in Kansas they can loose everywhere.